Exploring the evolving philosophy of leadership through a deeply personal, introspective conversation between Subba Vaidyanathan, a leadership coach, and Shyam Srinivasan, former MD of Federal Bank.
Subba Vaidyanathan: Twenty years ago, while working in a bank, I had many aspirations. But I noticed that people around me were burning out and becoming exhausted—this was in the aftermath of the global financial crisis. In response, I began teaching yoga at the workplace. That eventually evolved into helping people cope with stress more broadly.
Over the next ten years, I came to a deeper realisation: the real issue lay at the root, and no amount of yoga, Zumba, or meditation could truly resolve the underlying stress people experienced at work. I discovered that people were stressed because they couldn’t be their authentic selves at work. They struggled to connect the meaning of their work with their own lives—with who they truly were. That insight led me to leave the corporate world and dedicate myself to working with people—especially leaders—to create a different kind of world, both at work and at home. A world where people could feel more alive, more energetic, and more impactful.
Shyam Srinivasan: Two years ago, you shared a video with me about the woman leading Patagonia. The underlying theme was leadership—and how it can coexist with doing good. Both of us agreed that you don’t have to be aggressive or demanding to achieve corporate objectives.
I believe that in a corporate environment—which is often challenging, stressful, and demanding—if leadership or the organisational system enables people to feel good about themselves, the outcomes are invariably better. It’s the senior leadership and the governance structure that set the tone.
Over the years, I’ve worked in different geographies—multinationals, ethnically skewed environments, and diverse corporate cultures. Across all of them, one thing remains constant: we all live for self-worth. Self-esteem is central—not just for me, but for everyone. We want to feel good about ourselves. When large groups of people begin to believe that they can express themselves authentically, the results consistently exceed expectations. That’s when you know the institution is in a better place.
Subba Vaidyanathan: The work I do today is focused on helping people recognise what is truly extraordinary about themselves. I ask them to go back and reflect: in your most difficult moments, what skill or inner resource did you draw upon to overcome the challenge? How did you manage to succeed in adversity? When you examine those moments, you’ll notice a pattern. Whether it’s about enhancing your performance or navigating a crisis, you likely relied on a consistent set of skills or strategies.
Stick with those—discover them deeply—and you’ll unlock their full potential. And if you’re a leader, your job is to help others discover the same within themselves.
Today, I want to surface some real-life challenges that leaders face. They are often given very short runways to deliver extraordinary outcomes. The time pressure is intense. Leaders must constantly make difficult choices: people versus performance, growth versus governance, breaking boundaries versus respecting boundaries, innovation versus regulation, capital versus collateral.
Take capital, for instance—it relentlessly seeks immediate returns, but rarely considers the collateral damage. Patagonia approaches this differently. They care deeply about the environment because, as an outdoor company, they depend on it. Their logic is clear: if the environment is destroyed, there’s no outdoors left, and therefore, no business to run. That’s a different way of thinking about collateral.
Shyam, how do you see this dichotomy?
From “Or” To “And”
Shyam Srinivasan: We live in an “and” world, not an “or” world. It’s no longer about choosing this or that—it’s about embracing both. We don’t have the luxury of delivering outcomes at the cost of poor governance. It has to be about delivering strong results and maintaining strong governance. We don’t have the privilege of treating people poorly and still expecting performance. That belongs to a different era. Today, inappropriate behavior is called out almost instantly. As leaders, we must strive for balance and inclusivity.
Leadership today is a long-haul effort. It’s about building followership—not through dictation, but through evangelisation. This is where stakeholder management becomes crucial. You have to help people understand why we are doing what we are doing, and what the long-term vision is. Well-meaning people will buy into it. Of course, there will always be naysayers and challengers. But if you have deep conviction that the model you’re pursuing is both meaningful and sustainable, it will endure.
I’ve experienced this firsthand during my time at the bank. In the early years, after the initial honeymoon period, there were many who questioned me. Some even demanded my removal, saying, “He’s the wrong person for this job.” At the time, the bank’s stock price also saw a significant decline. The market tends to view things in binary—either they like you, or they don’t. Fortunately, I had the support of the board, which was willing to take those early hits and stand by the long-term vision.
The best answer to doubt is time and outcome. And by the grace of God, over a 14-year period, we were able to deliver reasonably good results. What made the difference? Time, yes. Balance, certainly. But above all—extreme conviction and authenticity. I’m not claiming that everything we did was perfect. But I do believe that when you deeply desire something, the universe aligns to make it happen. The Alchemist speaks of this, and I have personally experienced its truth.
This was never about a personal agenda—it was always about a larger institutional mission. When that becomes clear, support tends to follow. So for me, the keys are balance, authenticity, consistency, and a deep conviction that what you’re doing is right for the long haul—and then bringing your stakeholders along with you on that journey.
Subba Vaidyanathan: In today’s world, there are many opportunities to take shortcuts—people often try to innovate in the wrong areas just to deliver quick outcomes. But those shortcuts eventually come back to hurt, and often in a big way. Why do some leaders still choose this path?
Set Up the Drumbeat
Shyam Srinivasan: Gordon Gekko famously said, “Greed is good.” Many tend to view leadership solely through the lens of results and measurements. But there’s a theory—attributed to Charles Goodhart—which says: “When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.” Once results become the sole basis for declaring success, people start gaming the system.
Yes, there is pressure to perform. But the real challenge is delivering outcomes in a way that is authentic, sincere, and credible. That’s what true leadership signs up for. The essence of this lies in the rhythm—the “drumbeat”—of the organisation. Leadership is about inspiring people to rise to that beat, not about shortcuts.
If we look at some of the recent failures in the banking industry, many of them seemed to be doing everything right on the surface. And yet, they were later exposed for wrong practices. Why? Likely because they ignored or bypassed some of the more fundamental principles of integrity and governance. And because they were being rewarded in the short term, there was no immediate pushback. The internal checks—the governance, the challenge function—may have been subdued or silenced.
When we celebrate leaders, a critical question we must ask is: “Is this success timeless, or is it just timely?” Without naming names, we know of four or five banks that were once hailed as rockstars, only to falter in a relatively short time. And when the dust settled, it became clear that shortcuts and inappropriate practices had been allowed to persist.
So, who is responsible for calling this out? That’s where the role of regulators and governance frameworks becomes critical. Innovation often happens at the fringe of regulation. Most people like to play on that edge—pushing boundaries slightly, finding grey zones. But the problem is this: when you make many small compromises, their combined effect can be disastrous.
It’s not about making one mistake and winning. It’s about what you choose to do when no one is watching. That’s the real test of leadership. The companies that have endured—really stood the test of time—are the ones where leadership, not just individual but institutional leadership, made the right choices eight or nine times out of ten when no one was looking.
Even Jack Welch, after 25 years of being hailed for delivering extraordinary performance, saw the legacy of his leadership being questioned. In the long arc of time, everything is revealed—good, bad, and ugly. That’s why no one needs to pass premature judgment. Time is the ultimate judge.
A simple yardstick I use is this: Can you proudly tell your mother—or your wife, parent, brother, or anyone dear to you—about what you’ve done? If the answer is yes, you don’t need a rulebook. Because when you seek the pride of your well-wishers, you naturally choose the right path.
Look at RCB’s recent IPL victory—it was a moment of great triumph. But soon it became a tragedy. Poor planning and governance led to the loss of 11 lives. If only things had been better managed!
Subba Vaidyanathan: I often say, “If your son or daughter were watching you do this, would you still do it?” The legacy we leave behind—both at home and at work—truly matters.
Shyam, When you first joined Federal Bank, and especially over the years that followed, we saw the challenges that came with leading through uncertainty. When the share price was falling, you had to keep speaking with consistency and conviction. You had to bring stakeholders along with you. Even your employees were watching closely, wondering what was happening to the bank. In times like that, you need a deep personal conviction—something meaningful that drives you, something that makes you get out of bed and show up every single day. What was that for you?
Bad news takes the escalator
Shyam Srinivasan: People talk about Federal Bank being the “most admired bank” now, but that recognition came much later. The real question is—how did it all begin?
I believe that if the senior team—the leadership—is genuinely passionate and consistently displays that passion in both words and actions, a wider belief starts forming across the organisation. I’ve always said this—and maybe some of you remember the 1980s movie Flashdance—there’s a line in it that stuck with me and has been my guiding principle ever since: “Take your passion and make it happen.”
If people believe that their leaders are truly passionate about something, and they don’t see a disconnect between what is said and what is done, they begin to sign up for that vision. In large organisations, consistency is everything. The informal or “whisper” channel is far more powerful than any formal communication system. As the saying goes: Good news takes the staircase; Bad news takes the escalator; And wrong news takes a rocket launcher. That’s how fast misinformation spreads.
My own model is simple—belief leads to behaviour, behaviour leads to process, and process leads to outcomes. It’s a self-correcting loop. If there is institutional conviction, and the team sees that belief consistently reflected in leadership behavior, then alignment happens naturally.
One thing I’ve done was to put myself under a bit of pressure, in a good way. For 365 Sundays in a row, I wrote a message to the entire team. I didn’t miss a single Sunday. Every employee—from employee number 1 to employee number 25,000—received the same message, at the same time, on the same day every week. The content could be anything: something I observed in a branch, a business update, an event from the world outside, even something like Virat Kohli scoring a century. But the point was that it came from me directly, with no hierarchy, no filtering. And because it was consistent, it created a sense of shared rhythm and language.
So when I walk into a branch on Monday morning, chances are, people have read the Sunday message. They greet me, not just formally, but often by referring to what I wrote. That’s when you know the drumbeat of the organisation is beginning to sync.
So to answer your question: If belief and behavior are aligned—and sustained over long periods of time—that’s when real institutional change happens.
Subba Vaidyanathan: When you started, the bank had around 8,000 employees. By the time you left, that number had doubled to 16,000. I still remember you telling me about those early days—how the office didn’t even have an air conditioner and was overflowing with paper files. Fast forward to years later, and I walk into your training centre and am received by a robot! That transformation is massive—not just in infrastructure, but in culture and mindset.
Another major shift was in the age profile of your employees. The average age came down significantly. I know that platforms like Yammer helped you communicate your message across the organisation. But my real question is this: How do you get thousands of employees, spread across the country, to show up every day with energy and purpose?As a leader, that’s one of the most difficult challenges—to keep people inspired and aligned, day after day, across geographies.
The Power of Stamina
Shyam Srinivasan: One quality that is hugely underestimated in leadership is stamina. And I don’t mean just mental stamina—though that’s important too—but physical stamina. The demands on a leader’s physical endurance are extraordinary, and sometimes, I feel it’s only with divine grace that you’re able to sustain it. If you truly fall in love with your work, that passion fuels your energy.
Long-haul leadership, more than anything else, is about showing up—day after day—despite the pressures, the criticism, the highs, and the lows. You take the hits, smile through them, and keep going. Especially in the kind of bank I was leading, where impressions mattered a great deal, the leader often got more credit—or more blame—than was truly deserved. It was never proportional. It was either pedestal or pit. But that’s the reality.
I think this may be a particularly Indian phenomenon—we tend to over-celebrate heroism. Perhaps it’s because we don’t have enough visible heroes. Whatever the reason, there’s a tendency to deify leaders. And that can become a trap, because the admiration becomes addictive. Followership is like a drug. It keeps you going, not just because of ego, but because you don’t want to let people down. You want to keep earning that trust, day after day.
So yes, consistency and authenticity matter deeply. I would also add stamina to that list—both physical and intellectual. You have to believe in what you’re doing. You have to keep showing up, even when the external environment is hostile or indifferent. And let me say this: the external environment is the same for everyone—whether you’re at Axis Bank, ICICI, HDFC, Federal Bank, or SBI. The macro challenges don’t vary much. What makes the difference is the mindset of the team and the leadership’s resolve.
The winning mindset says: I’m going to face this. I’m going to show up. I’ll take the hits. I’ll smile through the storms. And I’ll keep going. That’s stamina. And sometimes, to be honest, you need divine help—because beyond a point, even your best effort might not be enough.
Subba Vaidyanathan: That brings me to the question of values. As a leader, what role do you play in upholding them? And what is the role of the board in reinforcing that?
Building Cohorts
Shyam Srinivasan: Let me add a point here. There is immense value in building a senior leadership team that is on the same wavelength as you. I was truly blessed—particularly during my time at Federal Bank. In fact, across most of my career, I’ve been fortunate with the teams I’ve worked with. But at Federal, my core leadership team—both Executive Directors and the CFO—remained the same for almost eight years. That kind of stability is a gift.
When you have that kind of alignment, you’re almost never alone in making tough calls. Yes, sometimes you might get it wrong, but you know you’re not second-guessing in isolation—you can rely on each other. The real message here is this: As a leader, it is your responsibility to build a cohort of people with whom you can have honest, agenda-free conversations rooted in conviction and integrity. That alignment doesn’t happen by default. It’s something you have to consciously create. It’s our job—to foster that capability and culture.
And when the alignment isn’t there, you have to make the tough calls. Sometimes, you have to “scissor it off”—let go of people who don’t fit. That’s never easy, but it’s necessary. In my view, the difference between success and failure in leadership doesn’t lie in the external environment—that’s largely the same for everyone. The difference lies in how effectively you create and engage the right cohort of people, whether it’s senior leaders or board members.
And here’s the key: you have to build that alignment before the fires break out. If you’ve built trust and transparency during calm periods, then navigating crises becomes much easier. The relationships and shared understanding you cultivate in the “non-burning” times determine how resilient you are when the heat is on.
Let me share something personal: just last weekend—nine months after I retired—37 people from my leadership team came home, and we spent 24 hours together like school kids. Singing, laughing, just reconnecting. It was incredible. And no one had to be there—they came because something meaningful had been built. Not just a workplace, but a sense of belonging.
These weren’t just young folks—three of my former Executive Directors were part of that gathering. It had transcended a professional relationship and become something deeper. That kind of bond is rare, and yes, it takes effort, and it doesn’t happen everywhere. But when it does, it creates a culture where people truly have each other’s back. That, to me, is the foundation of enduring leadership.
Subba Vaidyanathan: As we come toward the close of this conversation, I want to ask something very important.
In the middle of everything a leader has to handle—dealing with regulators, managing client relationships, making high-stakes business decisions, and attending countless meetings—how do you consciously set aside time, energy, and what I would call ‘leadership space’ to focus on people, culture, and values?
Work-Life Balance
Shyam Srinivasan: These are 24×7 jobs. There’s really no choice—you’re always “on.” In the end, everything is a trade-off. When you choose to do one thing, you’re inevitably giving up something else. But that’s the reality of leadership. And at some point, we all have to make those choices.
If you truly believe that this—people, culture, values—is your most important calling as a leader, then you have to commit to it. Sometimes, that means making a lonely call. But that’s a conscious decision—and it’s yours to make.
Now, I know I might be unpopular with some of my younger colleagues for saying this, but I don’t buy into all the noise around “work-life balance.” I’m not saying you should be irreverent about it—of course not. But I do think it’s overdone. Let’s be honest: you can’t be truly happy at work if you’re miserable at home—and vice versa. It just doesn’t work that way. Balance isn’t about doing less—it’s about working hard, with purpose, on the things that matter to you, both professionally and personally.
If you give culture a pass, you’ve essentially given your business a pass. As Peter Drucker famously said, “Culture eats strategy for breakfast.” Culture isn’t just a set of values on a wall—it’s what drives behavior. It’s what shapes decisions. And most importantly, it’s what sustains performance over time. Leadership sets the tone. They say, “Tone from the top, echo from the bottom.” That’s how culture lives and breathes in an organisation. Leadership is not about asserting dominance; it’s about creating harmony between direction and reflection.
Subba Vaidyanathan: Leadership goes far beyond OKRs and KPIs. In fact, I’ve seen this repeatedly in my work with leaders—the real moment of awakening often comes only after a major event. Sometimes it’s an organisational crisis; other times, it’s something deeply personal. The tragedy is that it takes such a cost—emotional, physical, or relational—to trigger reflection. Leadership today demands both clarity of purpose and depth of character—and they have to coexist.
Mahalingam: Shyam, what do you do to relax in your spare time—apart from cricket?
Shyam Srinivasan: (Laughs) I’ve been asked this question so many times, Mali. But honestly—for me, relaxation is doing what I’m already doing. I know that sounds boring, but that’s the truth. And here’s what I believe: Making boring sexy is the job of a leader. That’s something I genuinely live by. Especially in a bank—where a lot of work is routine—you have to find joy in the repetition, in the small wins, in the rhythm. That’s what keeps me going.
Grit: From Nadal to Nadella
Mahalingam: Who is a personality you admire? Someone whose qualities you’ve tried to imbibe?
Shyam Srinivasan: (Laughs) I don’t really follow any one individual in a cult-like manner. But I do observe and take inspiration from people who’ve demonstrated grit, consistency, and the ability to play the long game. Recently, I wrote a post about Rafael Nadal. He’s taken hit after hit—physically and metaphorically—and yet, he shows up, competes, and stays the course. That kind of mental fortitude inspires me.
In the corporate world, someone I’ve been greatly impressed with is Satya Nadella. I’ve had the good fortune of meeting him a few times—one-on-one and in small groups. And what he says in those rooms, you see reflected in his writing, his public interviews, and more importantly—in results.
He’s not some larger-than-life genius or radical inventor. He’s an ordinary person in many ways—average, maybe above average, definitely sharp—but what sets him apart is his clarity, consistency, cultural shift, and doggedness. Look at what he’s done with Microsoft—once seen as a tech dinosaur, now close to a $3 trillion company. That’s not magic—that’s sustained leadership. There’s a story there. A story worth paying attention to.
